The complete list:Before the war, all P-38's were made by Walther. These had commercial stamps, NO WWII codes.Starting in 1940 Walther used the code '480'. Only 7,200 were made.
RARE.Walther from 'About' 1940 on: 'ac'. Usually in lower case letters.Spreewerke: 'cyq'Mauser from 1942 to 1945: 'byf'.Mauser starting in 1945 to war's end: 'SVW' in LARGE case letters.The French assembled Mauser P-38's up until sometime in 1946.These had all the Nazi stamps, including the 'SVW' code stamp, only with the addition of a French 'Rounded Star' stamp.WWII coded Walther and Mauser P-38 pistols will also have a production year stamped on the slide. This is two digits. A Walther would be marked 'ac 43' as example.WWII P-38's were made in 10,000 gun 'blocks'. Well, I don't know what your buddy has, But there is no such thing as a legit 38 dated P.38 of any variety!Add svw to rpf's code list.
The byf code was changed in Dez 44. Also add the Spreewerk cvq which started in the z blockThe frogs did Not proof anything made by them durring the year + they operated the Oberndorff plant except with the star. All proofed parts were made prior to the end of the war. These parts ran out well before the end of svw 45 production. I've never heard of a legit svw 46 with any wartime proofed parts.Charlie - what is the ser nr on your 46? Is it all matching?Sarge. Well, I don't know what your buddy has, But there is no such thing as a legit 38 dated P.38 of any variety!Add svw to rpf's code list.
The byf code was changed in Dez 44. Also add the Spreewerk cvq which started in the z blockThe frogs did Not proof anything made by them durring the year + they operated the Oberndorff plant except with the star. All proofed parts were made prior to the end of the war. These parts ran out well before the end of svw 45 production. I've never heard of a legit svw 46 with any wartime proofed parts.Charlie - what is the ser nr on your 46? Is it all matching?SargeAll matching and blued( as a few were).
S/N range is 56- k. Think L was the last reported block. Inter Arms import in the 60s. To go with the BH marking a great 1957 dated Holster, marked 'STOLLA WIEN '.Gott'a agree with you Sarge. I was just gonna' let my statement stand 'cause I try NEVER to post anything that I'm not sure of. ' course I CAN be wrong. Yes, there were 500 Ls assembled some years later from stored parts.
I've got one or 2? The blued frog SVWs were police and the phosfate ones were military. I think the only SVW variant that I don't have is the unknown SVW 44. I had one in my hand at a denver gun show in the summer of 70, right after I got back from RVN. Wasn't for sale or trade or I'd own it.Buxton didn't believe me when I told him about it when he was working on his frist P.38 book. About 10 yrs ago he found a slide and conceeded that I might have actually held one since one has also shown up in Europe.Your BH is a nice variant.Sarge. My P-38 has 6602 as the serial number with a production code 'Eagle' 359.
That particular production code was for the 'Zero' series, and there is no zero int the sn prefix. Also, next to dissasembly lever, to the right of the SN is code 0'eagle'. The barrel has a sn of 4 52 with a C below it.
Mauser P38 Serial Number List
After looking at this site, none of the mumbers seem to make any sense. The gun has the 'zero' series 'Eagle' 359 code on all the parts, but the serial numbers contradict themselves. It also lacks the Walther banner which is supposed to be on that series. Either this gun is really unique, or was stamped with fake 'eagle' 359 codes to make it worth more.ill try to get some pictures.
My P-38 has 6602 as the serial number with a production code 'Eagle' 359. That particular production code was for the 'Zero' series, and there is no zero int the sn prefix. Also, next to dissasembly lever, to the right of the SN is code 0'eagle'. The barrel has a sn of 4 52 with a C below it.
After looking at this site, none of the mumbers seem to make any sense. The gun has the 'zero' series 'Eagle' 359 code on all the parts, but the serial numbers contradict themselves. It also lacks the Walther banner which is supposed to be on that series. Either this gun is really unique, or was stamped with fake 'eagle' 359 codes to make it worth more.ill try to get some pictures Yes, we definately need some photos because what you're saying does not make any sense at all!!!The eagle 359 is a WaffenAmt assigned to the Walther factory in 1937 or 38 and used on ALL Walther military production till the end of the war. It had Nothing to do with the 'production code', which was originaly 480 and in late 1940 was changed to ac.
What are the markings on the left side of the slide on your P.38???Sarge. Well, I don't know what your buddy has, But there is no such thing as a legit 38 dated P.38 of any variety!Add svw to rpf's code list. The byf code was changed in Dez 44. Also add the Spreewerk cvq which started in the z blockThe frogs did Not proof anything made by them durring the year + they operated the Oberndorff plant except with the star. All proofed parts were made prior to the end of the war. These parts ran out well before the end of svw 45 production. I've never heard of a legit svw 46 with any wartime proofed parts.Charlie - what is the ser nr on your 46?
Is it all matching?SargeNo cvqs from Spreewerke. All are cyq - but there are a number marked with a damaged stamp that are missing the tail of the 'y', and appear to by cvq. Or so I've been told by a guy who seriously collects P-38s.
No cvqs from Spreewerke. All are cyq - but there are a number marked with a damaged stamp that are missing the tail of the 'y', and appear to by cvq. Or so I've been told by a guy who seriously collects P-38s.Yes that is the contention of some, However based on 55 years of collecting P.38s and having examined and owned a lot of cvq marked pistols, I say BS!!!! Course maby I'm not a serious enuf collector since I've only written a couple of artikles on P.38s and contributed to Buxtons 3 vol set on the P.38.There was undoubtedly more than one machine stamping cyq codes on pistol slides AND other machines stamping them on bbls u. Locking blocks. Did ALL of these machines suddenly have broken dies??? Did the factory remove the tail on the y from these other machines because the die on one machine broke?
No way in Hell!!! In addition almost all of the cvq stamps are to smooth/even on the bottom to have been stamped with a broken die!Sarge. Yes that is the contention of some, However based on 55 years of collecting P.38s and having examined and owned a lot of cvq marked pistols, I say BS!!!! Course maby I'm not a serious enuf collector since I've only written a couple of artikles on P.38s and contributed to Buxtons 3 vol set on the P.38.There was undoubtedly more than one machine stamping cyq codes on pistol slides AND other machines stamping them on bbls u.
Locking blocks. Did ALL of these machines suddenly have broken dies??? Did the factory remove the tail on the y from these other machines because the die on one machine broke? No way in Hell!!! In addition almost all of the cvq stamps are to smooth/even on the bottom to have been stamped with a broken die!SargeSo the controversy (and controversy it is) continues.
WTwo serious P-38 collectors with differing views on the cyq/cvq issue for Spreewerke. And, AFAIK, the only documentation is for cyq. Interesting and - I think - something of a mystery. Hey, sarge, suggest you go have a look at this:Now, I don't claim 55 years of collecting experience like you, but ol' Ron seems to make a pretty good photographic case for the broken die.
The pictures he has makes it pretty clear.This is made more convincing by the fact that people have searched for YEARS for some kind of evidence for a document assigning the letters cvq to ANY factory, ANYWHERE, making ANYTHING. The HWaA kept exhaustive records and the letters cvq were NEVER assigned.
Especially not to Spreewerk; the records of WaPruf 2/I are clear on this. I don't know when those 'artikles' you wrote were published, but Buxton's 3 volume set was published in 1974, 37 years ago now. We've added to our knowledge since then. I thought this discussion on 'the broken die theory' first proposed by Buxton himself, ended two years ago.
Although he noted there may be other ideas, he definitely leaned towards a simple broken die. But, the proof is in the puddin'.
Mauser P38 Pistol Serial Numbers
It was modern forensic research and done professionally by a metallurgist, Jan Balcar himself a little over two years ago that confirmed the broken die. I spoke to him the week he thought of the research method and immediately after he finished it. Buxton had it right all along.broken die. No way to refute rock solid evidence performed by a specialist. And, the proof of the integrity of Mr.
Balcar stands on this.up until he saw with his own eyes the evidence displayed before him, he had never been a follower of the broken die! He argued for decades against it and was trying to prove it using the research. Instead, he had to admit he had been wrong all those years.
THAT, is an honorable man and goes to show how irrefutable the research really was. Yes, we definately need some photos because what you're saying does not make any sense at all!!!The eagle 359 is a WaffenAmt assigned to the Walther factory in 1937 or 38 and used on ALL Walther military production till the end of the war. It had Nothing to do with the 'production code', which was originaly 480 and in late 1940 was changed to ac.
What are the markings on the left side of the slide on your P.38???SargeLol been 2 years (got sidetracked.) but I finally got some picsI learned from my grandpa (who originally owned the gun) that it was assembled from parts at the MI state crime lab as his retirement gift from a friend (my grandpa was a detective in the state police). I already know it has mismatched grips, But the frame and slide match. Kind of a 'Franken-Pistol.'
GoBlue,The frame is a cyq, the E/88. The slide right side stamps will tell you the maker of the slide and once you disassemble on the barrel will be a inspection stamp which will tell you its maker. As you stated it is a frankenfish; but, it is a family heirloom from your granddad which means more than the shooter price that would attach to it.
When you know all the inspection stamps at least you can always say what the parts were.The frame is an 'O' series cyq which dates to April 1944. The slide having no suffix letter could be cyq, byf or AC. Hope this adds to its history; art.
Walther and Luger were the handgun providers to the German Army in World War II. Designed by Fritz Walther, Walther pistols were well-designed, reliable 9-mm firearms that were cheaper to produce than the Luger P08.
Although Walther designed and manufactured the P38, Mauser and Spreewerke also produced them to keep up with wartime demand. Production of the P38 ended with the war. However, in 1957, Walther manufactured a similar pistol, called the P1. Although there are specifics to look for, depending on the manufacturer, the P38 is an easily identifiable firearm. Identify the serial numbers.
After the manufacturer stamping, the serial numbers are stamped to the right of the pistol, above the handle. Each year and manufacturer had a different serial number system. The first-issue P38s in 1940 had serial numbers that ranged from 01 to 01000. However, 1943 models ranged from 1 to 9999n.
Mauser and Spreewerke P38s changed their system from year to year, with each year being unique. To identify P38 serial numbers, reference a P38 serial number listing, such as the one found on the Ole' Army Joel site. Zero models run from 01-013000, with the Walther banner.